Mana Games

[Santiago92]

Well, Chiller, Stuey and me discussed the punishments that Togt, Ro.Fed and Tenniskid deserve, so I will announce it:

Ro.Fed won't be able to play until July 2009 (Montreal), because while we are discussing if he had to continue as a MOD or not, he insulted a lot of people, their families and their countries.

Togt will be able to play US Open and he will be able to get points from that, and then he will be able to play only Shangai if he qualify and Challengers if we create that kind of tournaments. Also he will loss the points that he won since Notthingham (250 of Wimbledon + 75 of Newport + 40 of Notthingham = 365 points he'll loss).

We are still discussing the Tenniskid's punish (probably Emperor Young and him are the same person), so within 2 days we'll announce it.

[miguel]

ok, i was actually one of the people who met "angry Rofed", but still i think your punishment is way too harsh. I think you should think wether you are being moved by personal reasons, because one year without playing due to "improper conduct" is something i have never heard of. specially when compared with the punishment you are giving to Tog. I mean, attitude counts a lot, but the actions themselves are also the basic grounds for the punishments, right? You can't give the impression you are punishing according only to attitude, cause in that case anyone might consider all sorts of illegal actions and then have a very nice attitude after, cause it will be ok. i am not saying I don't agree with tog's punishment, i am just saying Rofed's is too harsh. If we all said he was an unfair moderator, we should not follow his footsteps.

[miguel]

Actually, i do not agree with Tog's punishment! who in the world punishes a player for a period, except the most important tournament?? A ban is a ban, what kind of idea are you trying to pass? And to do it because he requested it? he is the illegal player, he doesn't get to make requests.
You are giving punishments according to who you like, that is just a very bad idea, i think. I guess Martina should have asked to play the French Open before being banned for cocain abuse... That would have been smart...

[stuey]

Well, Miguel, we talked a lot about all these matters and these are our conclusions. Perhaps Ro.Fed's punishment should be reduced, but in my opinion the time should tell that. Ro.Federer hasn't shown any signs of admitting what he was doing whatsoever, and I don't think you have considered that. He was cheating, using his moderator skills in a very bad way, deleting posts he didn't like or he was afraid that might not do good for him, begging people on other forum to register and vote for him (i mean, come on... how pathetic you have to be to do that ), calling people names, insulting them and their families in the worse way, and, I repeat - didn't show any signs at all that he regrets what he was doing, he actually acts like he was enjoying it and like he is ready to do more of all that stuff Come on, what else do you need?

So, like he begged those people to vote for him, let him beg us to forgive him. Let him show us that he understands what he was doing. Let him admit he was doing bad things and acting in the worse way, making fun of everybody. Then we'll discuss about reducing his ban. Of course, Abel has the last word but this is my opinion.

So much about Ro.Fed.

About Togtdyalttai, I understand why you see his ban weird, but in my opinion it's fair and there's no need to change it. He's banned like until the end of the season, and since he hasn't done anything near as wrong as Ro.Fed did, we decided to make his wish come true so he could participate in US Open.

Edit: And Abel didn't mention it, but Togtdyalttai will be allowed to participate in League, while Ro.Federer won't. If someone doesn't understand this decision, read this post all over again.

[Santiago92]

Yes, we'll discuss about Ro.Fed's punish at the end of the season.

And I'm agree with all words Stuey said, Tog't didn't insult us and he admitted he was cheating, Ro.Fed didn't do the same and insulted a lot of us, so it is the main reason because the punish for him is for 1 year.

[miguel]

As for Rofed's punishment, i don't think i can add anything to what i have stated before. Anyway, i still think you are giving that ban because of personal reasons (for instance, Abel was one of the insulted ones, and he said he would ban him that long because of that). I don't think that people ruling these things should be moved by personal reasons. That's the job of a moderator, to separate personal from professional.

As for Tog, have you really considered everything?
- He created a "fake" player, he gave that player another nationality. In doing so, he insulted Rofed (yes ironic) and all canadians.
- He created an MSN account, he added numerous people to that account, he chatted with them. Then again, he disrespected Rofed. He created a sort of friendship with Rofed, just so Rofed would teach him some tricks, so he could get better.
- He applied to many tournaments with both nicknames. He registered to the same tourneys, giving himself twice as many chances to win the tourney.
- Actually, once Tog had to "play" with James Blake. Which means, Tog FIXED the result. The result was 6-0 6-0. He even posted on the forum, with James Blake account, saying he "hoped to get better". Which means, he insulted EVERYONE in the forum, making everyone a fool.
- He applied for the 2nd league with both players. That would result in an even graver consequence! He would have to fix 2results, and he would play twice as many matches than any other player on the 2nd league. He insulted specially Stuey, who is in charge of the league and who takes great effort in it. And still you think you should let him play...
- He apllied to Olympics with both players, which in my opinion in the worse of everything. Because in doing so he insulted Canadian nation, and he insulted the whole spirit of the Olympic Games. The Olympics are all about fairplay, about being proud for your nation, about giving the best you have. Tog was a disgrace for the Games. Even if it's just a game, the Olympics spirit, which is sacred to me, was corrupted.
- He decided to continue playing with both players, even after he was warned he should quit registering to tournaments with both players. He only showed regret when EVERYONE discovered about it.

So, just because he showed "regret" (actually, he had no way out of this, there was absolutely no chance to deny he has created two different players) you think he can play US Open. I think that is a huge mistake. I believe, this way, it really does compensate to take illegal actions to get ahead of other players.

Great punishment!!!

[Togtdaylttai]

Miguel, I know what I did was a horrible thing. However, you have some misconceptions about it. My point of making another player was partly to insult Ro.Fed. My way of going about it was extremely flawed, but i was bothered about the way he played and felt I needed to do something about it.

I didn't learn anything from Ro.Fed using my other account, and my only point in asking him to "help" me was because I found that humorous.

With entering tournaments, I didn't think at all about the fact that I was giving myself another chance to win. My point was to gain experience, and I know that my way of doing this was once again flawed. I'm extremely sorry for taking chances away from others, for everyone I beat using that account (Eronakold, Milos, Odetus, and anyone else I missed).

When I had to play myself, I really don't know what there was for me to do. I had to fix the result one way or another.

With league, I'm glad I never got the chance to play with two profiles. I wish I hadn't signed up, but once again, this all ties back to Ro.Fed. To keep up the farce that I wasn't James Blake, I did whatever he suggested. This included signing up for tournaments. To make myself seem like another person and be able to trick him, I felt like I needed to do things as differently as possible. I'm very sorry for insulting anyone else in the process. I wish I could do more than apologize, but the deed is already done, and I can't go back and change the past.

As for the Olympics, I'm also glad that I didn't play with two profiles in them. Here in America, we don't take the Olympics as seriously as those in other countries do. But that's no excuse; I feel awful for trying to compromise the Olympic spirit.

And with Ro.Fed's punishment, you have to realize that he is still trying to do whatever he can to disrupt tournaments. He signed up 4 times for Cincinnatti. He created another "North American" tournaments site to draw people away from the main tournaments. And he insulted people's families. If I were on the receiving end of one of those insults, I would feel extremely angry. As it is, I don't blame Chiller and others for not having anything to do with him. He abused his position as Moderator to win tournament matches. What he did was not just under a single category like what I did; it encompassed the whole way he played the game.

Once again, I'm very sorry for creating a fake account and all the things that accompanied that. I'm glad to be able to play in the US Open, as it is the most important tournament to me as an American. I can understand your feelings about what I did, but I do feel that what Ro.Fed did was worse than what I did.

[stuey]

Ok, Miguel, I understand that everyone have their own opinion and I understand why you feel like this is an unfair decision by us. Our decision is not just because of personal needs. Ro.Federer can insult everyone with his attitude. If nothing else, he proved that. And we just really do not want to have this kind of player in tournaments. As Togtdyalttai said, he even now tries to block our work and to make things harder for us.

And do you know what would happen with your post if Ro.Federer was one of us? It would be deleted.

It is our opinion that Ro.Federer deserved this treatment and it is your opinion that he didn't.

And yes, I thought about what Togtyalttai did well, but still do not think there should be changes in punishments.

[miguel]

Stuey, i do feel it is very disturbing to know that Tog actually had a choice in the matter about his punishment. Punishments are not to be given based on any "choice" the person in question has made. It's ridiculous that Tog got to choose to play US Open and skip the rest of the tournament instead of doing a shorter ban which would include that grand slam. He should have no choice in the matter. that's why there are (FOUR) moderators, to choose!

and also, i wrote a very long post about tog, and u answererd mostly about rofed... which only confirms that you are doing everything according to what you feell about Rofed. What tog did, for me it doesn't matter if it was to make fun of Rofed (whose attitudes we all dislike). What he did should be punished in a objective matter. And it is clearly NOT being held that way.

For all these reason, i have decided NOT to play the US Open, in case Tog is still allowed to play.
I believe if there is a proper punishment for all the deception he created, is NOT to play the US Open. I think this is a very disgraceful situation.

[stuey]

Stuey, i do feel it is very disturbing to know that Tog actually had a choice in the matter about his punishment. Punishments are not to be given based on any "choice" the person in question has made. It's ridiculous that Tog got to choose to play US Open and skip the rest of the tournament instead of doing a shorter ban which would include that grand slam. He should have no choice in the matter. that's why there are (FOUR) moderators, to choose!

and also, i wrote a very long post about tog, and u answererd mostly about rofed... which only confirms that you are doing everything according to what you feell about Rofed. What tog did, for me it doesn't matter if it was to make fun of Rofed (whose attitudes we all dislike). What he did should be punished in a objective matter. And it is clearly NOT being held that way.

For all these reason, i have decided NOT to play the US Open, in case Tog is still allowed to play.
I believe if there is a proper punishment for all the deception he created, is NOT to play the US Open. I think this is a very disgraceful situation.

I read everything u wrote, I just had nothing much to comment on Togtdyalttai. In my opinion, you are overreacting. For example, the parts where you're saying he applied with two names for one tournament(league, etc.) , well that was expected if he already had two names, wasn't it? I mean everything after he first applied with two names was logical, and you're insisting on it like it was something horrible.
Well, of course, for you it might be. We, people, do not all have same taste or opinions. But to me, all of that, taking in account everything he said, just doesn't look so horrible. Like some people who are punished in different ways have some wishes, to be free, to get their punishments reduced etc., Togt had a wish to play US Open. And taking everything into account, we decided to take away all his points made on Nottingham, Wimbledon and Newport, to take away all ATP tournaments till the end of the season, except, we let him play US Open.

That's how we feel, and I think that's ok, and believe me, it's not based on subjective matter, but objective.

I feel very sorry because of your decision, I didn't expect that I hope you will reconsider what you said...

Still, all of these were my thoughts, I would definitely like to talk with Chiller and Abel about everything what you said, so I hope I'll meet them online tomorrow.

I really wouldn't like you to miss the US Open just because of this

PS. Rick, I hope you'll soon get back from hospital.

[Santiago92]

Togt won't be able to play Olympics, and his account called J.Blake has been banned...

[TTennisfan]

Simply lol ,

a punishment of 12 months, abt that I don't care, I gave 10 months of punishment to Togt, I felt it was too long, so I reduce him to January, and now U once again reduce his punishment, and uses ur moderator skills, Sorry but this is Mod Skills,
Do u really think I'll waitt till July 2009 to play that crap, if yes, U are stupid, Have u ever seen a ban of 12 months ! LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL


I quote : Ro.Fed won't be able to play until July 2009 (Montreal), because while we are discussing if he had to continue as a MOD or not, he insulted a lot of people, their families and their countries.

Excuse me, Now I'm sure that there is only 1 dumass who can tell this, and it's Chiller, I insulted a lot of ppls? families, countries ? WTF .. WHAT THE F*CK!
Was it on a match? Was it on the forum?
Was it on MSN? Yes, so MSN isn't the game, so I could say whatever i Want on that, If u aren't happy with my comments, simply Block me, and I forget u.


And LIKE U DON'T KNOW HOW TO MAKE A GOOD PUNISHMENT, I THINK THAT TENNISKID OR E.YOUND DON'T DESERVE A REAL PUNISHMENT, CUZ HE IS ON THAT TOUR SINCE 2 WEEKS (around)

July 2009 lool

This is why it 's a HUGE mistake!

OMG' MODERATOR SKILLS, MODERATOR SKILLS, ALL OF U KEEP RUNNING UR MOUTH , like U are mr.perfect who knows everything abt everywhat, ya, always run ur mouth, but since all of u agree that I use my Mod skills, just give me 3 simply 3 examples of My «mod skills» abt deleting topics that was 3-4 days ago so it doesn,t count and when I said Mod skills this means ban ppls, Saying them U are out of this , that etc, C'MON

I want some of you, and btw about Chiller, I simply want to get him out of my world, In my head my goal was to insult or attacked 4 ppls, not the whole tour, only 4 ppls, I am now out of all those 4 so I'm happy and I don't care of how long u'll penalized me for this, but I WILL NEVER «regret» what I have done since i was mod (February) I maybe regret one thing it was vs milos and other things about my «insults», but the REST NEVER , U can Even quote me :

NEVER

Result : I am proud of what I have done to keep those tournaments alive, all organizations that I made (Nations cup, US Open Series, World Cup and even more) so I'll said this 1 more time, I'LL never regret, maybe of some attacks to E.Dementieva (Wimbledon), Miguel (Practice) and Milos (Miami)
Oh and btw I completly agree at 100% abt miguel's opignon even it's not completly on my side
AND ALL OF U , who thinks that Tog is a good guy, U are wrong, even he's worst then me maybe he don't attack and insult, but trying to get him always in the board (which means : Try to forget all his Mistakes)

U aren't in the right place to talk Togt, U have made a HUGE a HUGE KInd of cheating, and tell ppls about my mistakes, hey hey this isN't how things work, if U are doing something like that You are very bad placed to speak about the others then look at your hands before looking at the others, and don't try to prouve ur fake personality cuz u don't have anyone


EDIT: Stuey, Abel, Chiller, don't think that u are god, to decide a huge punishment for everyone and even fix a punishment THIS SORRY BUT ISN,T GOOD, When someone make a punishment we shouldn't touch it, so I 'm telling that these mods, excudling E.Dementieva who didn't particpate in that verdict are bad, just remember this : U aren't god, so I'm sure that anyone who will get 1 year of punishment will be sad of it, cuz it doesn't affect me at all.



Part 2

ONCE AGAIN THIS IS A GAME, NOT REAL ATP, U ARE ALL ACTING LIKE IF I USED STEROIDS, INEGAL DRUGS, etc. and no i didn't touch this stuff in my whole life (steroids)


Ro.F contrôlé positif looooooooool!


YA I'M THINKING OF MORe, NOW

E.G : U COULD ASK Roshane or Marcel Melo they got banned for 2 weeks, and it was exactly the same reason the same, than mine and u banned me till July 2009.......


WHEN MARTINA HINGIS WAS CONTROLED POSITIVE during a test she was suspended for I think 2 years, and she gave excuses WTA didn't reduce his punishment cuz of her regret, since u all think this is a ATp, I think u shud follow that rule, and if I said that it's abt tog i don't think he shud be able to play U SOpen and banned for the rest this is totally crap

[Santiago92]

All nice, but...

Excuse me, Now I'm sure that there is only 1 dumass who can tell this, and it's Chiller, I insulted a lot of ppls? families, countries ? WTF .. WHAT THE F*CK!
Was it on a match? Was it on the forum?
Was it on MSN? Yes, so MSN isn't the game, so I could say whatever i Want on that, If u aren't happy with my comments, simply Block me, and I forget u.

EDIT: Stuey, Abel, Chiller, don't think that u are god, to decide a huge punishment for everyone and even fix a punishment THIS SORRY BUT ISN,T GOOD, When someone make a punishment we shouldn't touch it, so I 'm telling that these mods, excudling E.Dementieva who didn't particpate in that verdict are bad, just remember this : U aren't god, so I'm sure that anyone who will get 1 year of punishment will be sad of it, cuz it doesn't affect me at all.

2 things:

- Would you really like that I quote a message you insulted my mother?
- The words which are underlined are the same that I said to Togt when I went out of the forum because your decision about my match in Wimbledon

[TTennisfan]

- Who cares about ur mother , I am not talking abt her right now, and anyway I didn't ask a question to u I simply said that this was on MSN

- The words which are underlined are the same that I said to Togt when I went out of the forum because your decision about my match in Wimbledon

Huh, yes maybe u tell me that but U let me no choices to reply and did I Banned someone for 1 year?! LOL what an idiot

[Marcelo Melo]

ok guys IM OUT
is unfair what you did with Ro.Fed

he was banned for the same reason that I 2 weeks ago, so I went for only 2 weeks and he 1 year.do the shit they want here now because the tour will be suck