Mana Games

[Actarus69]

I voted No.

Although I've been playing TE4 for a week, I've played TE2013 for almost 10 years, and the service has remained the same, and I'd like it to stay that way, I find it excellent.

I've been playing with the x-box 360 controller for pc for years and have learned to measure strength with simple button presses, whether it's a strong, normal, or safe serve. Any other method would not help me, that's fine by me.

And then with a charging bar it would seem to me like going back to the Top Spin days that I played on Windows in 2008-2009, before switching to Linux, and which I didn't like, it didn't feel like a real simulation here.

Generally speaking then, in tennis games I really don't like having a charging bar for shots, not even possibly for forehand or backhand shots.

One of the many things I like about this wonderful game, is the absence of these bars.

[KINGBARBOZA]

I voted No. [...]

It's a fun and easy serve system but online it is completely awful as its 100% based on luck. Serving should be skill-based.

[Actarus69]

It's a fun and easy serve system but online it is completely awful as its 100% based on luck. Serving should be skill-based.

I don't play online, I don't have an opinion about it.

[Snake Doctor]

Please never, ever do this. Please.

I hate with a passion tennis games that have timing bars for serving. Serving is about placement and muscle memory. This is incredibly well achieved in the game by understanding your serve, how far you can push the analogue sticks (on controller, not sure how keyboard works), and the optimal height of the ball to get max power.

A timing bar to me is arcade-y as hell. IMO, it has no place in the most realistic (and best) tennis game ever.

[KINGBARBOZA]

Please never, ever do this. Please.

I hate with a passion tennis games that have timing bars for serving. Serving is about placement and muscle memory. This is incredibly well achieved in the game by understanding your serve, how far you can push the analogue sticks (on controller, not sure how keyboard works), and the optimal height of the ball to get max power.

A timing bar to me is arcade-y as hell. IMO, it has no place in the most realistic (and best) tennis game ever.

There is nothing more arcade than a pure rng based serve system void of any skill. I don't know what you are talking about with "optimal height of the ball to get max power". It is literally hold-down button + aim left or right, and then the game rolls the dice on whether the serve goes in or not, and what speed it will be at.

You are focusing on the visuals of a timing + power bar being arcadey, rather than thinking about the actual gameplay and mechanic.

The power bar and timing bar simply adds more skill and player-controlled elements to the serve. Have you ever played online, where at the moment it's just a complete dice roll on if you make a serve in or not, and aces are 90% of the time based on complete luck, it can be extremely frustrating as there is nothing you can do control whether you make an ace/fast serve, you just have to hope that you get lucky.

[KINGBARBOZA]

Hi Manu,

Is this still something you are planning to do?

[manutoo]

KINGBARBOZA,
yes, I'm still thinking about it and I'm annoyed I was not able to get to it last summer. Now, I put it on low priority, so I'll reconsider it after the console ports & the movement animation improvements.

[Thomas]

Don't remove the current server system please!!! It's perfect

[manutoo]

Thomas,
at this point, I wouldn't remove anything, this would be just an additional option.

[KINGBARBOZA]

Hi Manu,

Now that 1.0 is out, is it safe to assume this won't get implemented anymore?

[manutoo]

KINGBARBOZA,
it's unlikely at this point, but not impossible ; I'll still add features to the game from time to time. We'll see if I feel like testing this new system or not...

[anrox335]

There is nothing more arcade than a pure rng based serve system void of any skill. I don't know what you are talking about with "optimal height of the ball to get max power". It is literally hold-down button + aim left or right, and then the game rolls the dice on whether the serve goes in or not, and what speed it will be at.

You are focusing on the visuals of a timing + power bar being arcadey, rather than thinking about the actual gameplay and mechanic.

The power bar and timing bar simply adds more skill and player-controlled elements to the serve. Have you ever played online, where at the moment it's just a complete dice roll on if you make a serve in or not, and aces are 90% of the time based on complete luck, it can be extremely frustrating as there is nothing you can do control whether you make an ace/fast serve, you just have to hope that you get lucky.

I mean, at some point, everyone masters the timing system, and all serves become similar, which is unrealistic. The serve decides the point in like 65-75% of the time in ATP, as well as TE4, which is extremely realistic. I think the real skill should be how you anticipate what kind of serve is coming and position yourself accordingly. Similarly, the skill for the server should be mixing things enough so that opponents are not able to anticipate the serve well. The current status of the game is OK, with the kick serve being a little weaker and should be made stronger to induce more position-based errors.

The proposed system sounds good as you evaluate the risk vs reward be selecting the power of the serve. Other games like FA Tennis use a Gaussian error system even if they have a timing system, so it is not 100% skill-based for them. I think the proposed system is certainly an upgrade over the current one. Hopefully, this comes with the January release. One suggetion I have is making the slice and kick dynamic, as almost all modern controllers have analogue triggers which can be used for this purpose.