Mana Games

[btaylor]

Hi Tog,

Funny, most of my tennis life I've been a baseliner (albeit an aggressive one), although I'd always been a bit envious of those who COULD effectively work their way in and "wheel & deal" at the net...

As my game progressed (along with my age ) I became more of an aggressive "all-courter" who will serve & volley more than occasionally, as I'm still pretty athletic...

While not a "true" serve & volleyer, I do immensely respect the talent, touch, and hand/eye co-ordination of those (pro & amateur) who can...as it's an art unto itself, and not easlily mastered...that's why I'm such a fan of Pete, Edberg, Rafter, Henman, etc...

[Leena]

Your game is like the Akgul's! Where's she on your list?

Akgul's serve is disappointing for a tall girl, like Bovina's.

I'm still waiting for next Big Brenda Schultz.

[Leena]

Even if the pundits declare that it's impossible to play s/v tennis in the "modern" era, it may just be AS possible if the young junior players are properly taught the s/v technique at an earlier age...instead of just smacking forehands and two-hand backhands back and forth...

Volley technique is still taught, but it's true that racket technology has killed the net game. It's so simple now for even juniors to dip topspin shots at net player's feet, and hit angles that couldn't even be tried before.

When Ivo Karlovic, a very good volleyer for his height, mostly stays back on hardcourt, the serve & volley game is officially dead.

[btaylor]

I said "PROPERLY" taught...
Ivo doesn't stay back on 1st serve, and when he DOES stay back he is CERTAIN to lose mostly because he has virtually NO ground game at that level....He can't stay in a groundstroke rally long enougth to be ABLE to work his way into the net...

But then again, you're probably right in your assumption that the s/v game is dead, especially since it looks for the forseeable furure that ALL courts will be SLOOOOOWWWWW....which I feel is at least as much of, if not MORE a factor than the "new" racquets...

Hmmm... let's see, how shall I explain this?
FASTER courts rob pros, juniors and everybody else of the prep time to set up with HUGE swings to hit all those perfectly dipping and angled returns so effectively when under pressure...

[Togtdyalttai]

But then again, you're probably right in your assumption that the s/v game is dead, especially since it looks for the forseeable furure that ALL courts will be SLOOOOOWWWWW....which I feel is at least as much of, if not MORE a factor than the "new" racquets...

I have to say I'm against most surfaces (especially Wimbledon's grass) being so slow. I'd like to see more tournaments on Super-fast surfaces like maybe the IH court at Winston-Salem or the carpet that got the Croats fined in Davis Cup. I may be a big fan of the clay game, but I like variety as much as the next guy. That's why it's so nice to see the fast grass at Queen's (which allowed the aforementioned Dr. Ivo to take Nadal to a 3rd set tiebreak last year) right after the French Open and the clay season have ended. I don't really know what I'm getting at here, but I tried.

[btaylor]

Tog,

"Variety" is all I'm getting at also...

When I said that my favorite player was Pete Sampras and why, is when we seemed to have gone slightly "off topic" about serve & volley vs. baseline tennis...

While I really don't necessarily advocate kamikaze style s/v at all costs ALL of the time, it certainly would be nice to see it implemented more often than it is now, on all of the surfaces...

It's frustrating to watch players get the other guy TOTALLY out of the point, on the defensive over and over again, only to have the opponent" wiggle off of the hook", so to speak, simply because they either don't have the skills, or are afraid to take the chance to go forward and "end" the damn point...

[Leena]

For a good comparison on how racket technology has effected tennis, watch some Geezer matches.

The final in Dubai with Edberg vs. Courier is a fine example. Back on tour, Stefan could approach on Jim's weaker backhand and usually control the point. Can't do that anymore... Jim's backhand is far better now than in his heyday.

Speaking of Pete, watch him now. His backhand is a WEAPON. Simply because he can control it more.

Now, every player can crack winners from any position basically. It's ruined the individuality of players, and made tennis more of an athleticism contest. I prefer the old days...

[btaylor]

Hey Leena,

Actually Courier used to also give Edberg plenty of problems "back in the day" with his "baseball swing" backhand...

I DID see that Dubai match, and I also saw Rafter absolutely BUSHWHACK Jim 6/3,6/2 in the semis of another Champion's tourney by playing what...you guessed it..serve & volley tennis!! (Uhh...he was coming in on Jim's "better" backhand")

Pete AND Courier BOTH used the Wilson Pro Staff 6.0 back then, and they BOTH use Wilsons now...
Courier uses the Ncode Tour 90 and Pete uses the K pro Staff 88...

I used to own and hit with both the Pro Staff 6.0 and the N code Tour 90, and as I now use the K factor Tour 90, I can tell you from experience that there's not a hell of a lot of difference between 'em in terms of swing weight and power...

While Pete's topspin backhand is a BIT stronger than the "old" days, I'd hesitate to call it a "weapon" even at that level, as he still "shanks" quite a few of 'em...(incidently, Pete's stick was WAY heavier than mine, and his new racquet is 12.3 oz. unstrung and STILL he uses extra lead on it!!)

I guess what I'm getting at is that those sticks that they were using back then weren't so much different from what's being used on the World Tour now, which gives weight to the argument of "court surface speed" being more of a major factor in today's tennis than just racquet technology...(even if Johnny Mac still harps on about it...heck HE never really HIT the ball anyway )

[Callan09]

Seems i have sparked a very good debate here

I agree with everything that has been said so far like the fact that baseline play is overly dominant nowadays, although some players do still have the capabitlity to play serve and volley ( Ancic, Karlovic etc. ).

I think that this method has been edged out due to the simple fact that serve and volley is just not taught to juniors. As a tennis coach myself, i can safely say that throughout my career (so far) i have very rarely been asked to ellaborate on this technique. Juniors learn from baseline topsin.

Also, in this era of play, it is highly difficult to succesfully make an approach to the net and finish off the point. Think about it. If you have made a good enough approach shot to go to the net, it will either be a winner, or force the error. If it does neither of the above, then the opponent will clearly make a simple lob, or passing shot.

I personally think it would be great to see more s&v in the modern game

[Callan09]

Can anyone tell me if there is any s&v on the WTA tour?

Its just i have never really seen a full WTA match

[Togtdyalttai]

Can anyone tell me if there is any s&v on the WTA tour?

Its just i have never really seen a full WTA match

You could say Srebotnik is, I guess.

[Callan09]

Where is she in the world, top 50?

[Leena]

Srebotnik rarely s&v in singles. She's the type that tries to be a power player from the backcourt despite not having the strength for it, thus why she's eternally ranked 20-40.

Sam Stosur and Roberta Vinci probably volley the most from the top 50. Niculescu does a fair amount, she's the WTA version of Fabrice Santoro with slice forehands and general wackiness.

[Richou]

Edit to my last post, I do not play like gasquet, i suck at tennis my backhand is mildly better than my forehand, which lead to my first post

[Roy Patrick]

My favorite player of all time would probably have to be Sampras. There's nothing like seeing him do a jump smash or one of those crazy on the run forehands.

My current favorite player would have to be Nadal. He stands out from the rest of the field nowadays and I like that about him. He's got a lot of heart too. It's nice to see him giving everything he has on every point.