Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby manutoo » 22 Feb 2010, 04:13

S.Williamz, 1st match was played with 117ms lag, & the 2nd one with 33ms lag. So it's sure there's a world between the 2. It's much harder to return with the lag, coz all ur reactions happened 117ms later ; same during the rallies...
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby Stajus » 22 Feb 2010, 04:34

manutoo wrote:S.Williamz, 1st match was played with 117ms lag, & the 2nd one with 33ms lag. So it's sure there's a world between the 2. It's much harder to return with the lag, coz all ur reactions happened 117ms later ; same during the rallies...

Higher ping makes it easier to return. Anyways, 117 ms and 33 ms should be pretty much the same, both are lagless. At 300 ms you can return serves much easier though and rarely get aced.
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby S.Williamz » 22 Feb 2010, 04:35

I agree with stajus.

I doubt ping has anything to do with this for several reason:

1. There was no visible lag at all, game run completely smoothly, despite the higher ping.

2. Lag makes the game slower, not faster. Thus, with lag it's actually easier to return(if it's not skippy lag). Not by much though, most lag doesn't have such dramatic effect on the game as seen in the videos.

3. I can have a "super fast" match with any ping, or a slower match with any ping. It is not consistent so ping cannot be the reason for this issue.
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby manutoo » 22 Feb 2010, 05:01

:roll:
TE Lag can go up to 117ms. That's for roughly 230ms ping. So as long as the ping is under 230ms, the game should run smoothly (if the ping is constant and symmetrical, & if the Lag is correctly set at start of the match). But all your reactions will be delayed, thus the impression of faster game.
Once the ping is above 230ms, the game doesn't add any further delay to your reactions ; instead, it'll run more slowly ; for example, at ~300ms, 1 second in-game will actually last about 1.5s in real life. Thus, it gives you much much more time to react.

One additional note : standing at 3 meters after the baseline to receive a 200km/h serve gives you roughly 0.80s to react & position yourself, so yes, 0.084s ( = 117ms - 33ms) is a big deal, that's more than 10% of the time consumed by the Lag.

Lastly, the Lag could be set high at beginning of match, with the ping going down after a while, thus the feeling to have a "fast" match even if the ping is low.
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby S.Williamz » 22 Feb 2010, 06:40

Hmm sounds really odd...delay? Shouldn't there be delay in ball speed also? Delay in whole game? Why is there delay only in reactions? Sorry I don't get that. lol

The problem is the game plays like completely different game depending if it's faster or slower or maybe in between. It's quite hard to get used to all the different "versions". Also for example if the game is really slow it's impossible to win against spin even on grass. Is there anything that can be done make to make it more consistent regarless if ping affects it? I don't remember such issues before, I started noticing last year. Maybe some update made it more prominent or something(perhaps the "antilag"...no idea just throwing it out there lol). :?
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby S.Williamz » 22 Feb 2010, 21:27

So I've paid attention to ping and so far it's been consistent that the lower the ping, the slower the match and the higher the ping the faster. That would explain why I have very fast matches with many US players for example. About 30 ms has been consistently very slow, and 117 ms very fast, and in between mid speed. This also explains why there are such differing views on topspin's effectiveness. If the ping is lower it's pretty much impossible to hit any winners, if it's higher then the spin is not really that much overpowered on other than slower courts.
It's quite funny though how depending on ping the game plays like a different game requiring very different tactics. Again I hope something could be done to make it play more consistent regardless of ping.

I'm really interested in this "antilag" thing...I think I might have started noticing all of this weird stuff more after it was put in the game. Is it possible it does more harm than good?

I have another issue related to this I will post more about it later.
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby manutoo » 23 Feb 2010, 07:59

S.Williamz, almost everything has been told already about the antilag :
search.php?st=0&sk=t&sd=d&keywords=antilag
mostly in this topic :
topic15-1971.php?hilit=antilag

If you want a consistent game whatever the ping is, u can force the Lag to be 117ms when starting a game. (Maybe I should have named it "Delay" instead of "Lag", it would have been less confusing with the common usage of the word "lag" in the forum... :fear: )
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby S.Williamz » 23 Feb 2010, 15:22

I would love force that delay if I could host games...but I cannot host games because of the well know error a lot of people seem to be getting(which just won't go away and I have tried everything. I haven't got that problem with anything else except TE. Still can't host games).
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Re: Game Balance Problems with Top Spin, Drop Shot, Lob, etc...

Postby S.Williamz » 25 Feb 2010, 09:58

Btw, about "forcing lag" I don't think it works because even if there's 250 max ping the lag can be that or below...so I don't quite understand how do you force it to stay at 117? lol
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