auto-pos & realism

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auto-pos & realism

Postby marty2756 » 13 Oct 2013, 16:05

Hi

First of all , I think TE is the best tennis-sim game so far, by far.., and I've played every sim-tennis out there.
Now, one thing that, besides the 'help' provided for positioning that is not something bad , I find visually unreallistic, is the player just 'skidding' or moving 'frozen' when doing autopos (high,med or low),
Is there anyway fo disable auto-pos ? (totally off)?

Thanks
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby manutoo » 15 Oct 2013, 14:31

Hello,

your racket sweetspot is 5cm wide ; removing the autopos would mean you'd not be able to position your player correctly in most cases (your player needs a 1/30th of second to move of 5.5cm when walking at 6km/h), and in the rare cases you'd manage to do it, you'd not have the time to aim left/right anymore.
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby marty2756 » 16 Oct 2013, 13:49

Thanks for the reply!
and Understood. But do you get what i meant by player just skidding or moving it 'frozen' when doing the autopos?... (sorry 'im not engligh native)
perhaps you already know but its too difficult to replace it with an anim with "split steps"
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby manutoo » 17 Oct 2013, 08:53

Yes, this is a problem ; unfortunately, it's pretty hard to do good little footstep animations.
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby Yasin Ozkan » 17 Nov 2013, 20:13

I suggested earlier to put a delay on autopositioning, because it reacts instantly like a robot when the opponent strikes the ball at the direction, but we are supposed to be humans with reflexes :-)
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby manutoo » 18 Nov 2013, 05:05

yasinozkan,
as it is now, it's quite helpful for lower reflexes people to return their opponent's serve, and while volleying (where you have a lot of stuff to do in a very short time).
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby Yasin Ozkan » 02 Dec 2013, 17:04

manutoo wrote:yasinozkan,
as it is now, it's quite helpful for lower reflexes people to return their opponent's serve, and while volleying (where you have a lot of stuff to do in a very short time).


I can understand the volleying, and it has a skill for it too (net presense or something) which is cool.
But when it comes to returning serve, or in rallies, if there are lower reflex people, with some training they will learn those reflexes ;-)
I mean that's how it is in real life, you have to learn it. So the (instant)auto-pos system ruins the realism of this beautiful game.
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby manutoo » 03 Dec 2013, 06:08

yasinozkan,
quick reflexes are still needed to achieve the best returns ; the autopos trick only helps to reduce the gap between the fastest & slowest reacting players.
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby Yasin Ozkan » 05 Dec 2013, 19:09

manutoo wrote:yasinozkan,
quick reflexes are still needed to achieve the best returns ; the autopos trick only helps to reduce the gap between the fastest & slowest reacting players.


Well there is no autopos trick in real life that helps the slowest reacting players, so neither should there be one in this game :-)
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby Elias » 05 Dec 2013, 23:16

yasinozkan wrote:Well there is no autopos trick in real life that helps the slowest reacting players, so neither should there be one in this game :-)


I agree. Being for serve return or rallies. I'm not against it at all but a custom setup to have the choice for it, and/or tweak this aspect of gameplay would be great.
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby manutoo » 06 Dec 2013, 05:28

yasinozkan,
if you play tennis 6 hours per day for the next 20 years, you probably still won't be as good as Federer, Nadal nor Djokovic. TE is a game so people can enjoy being a top player ; for being a crappy one, they still can go on a real court... :yes:
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby Yasin Ozkan » 06 Dec 2013, 11:54

manutoo wrote:yasinozkan,
if you play tennis 6 hours per day for the next 20 years, you probably still won't be as good as Federer, Nadal nor Djokovic. TE is a game so people can enjoy being a top player ; for being a crappy one, they still can go on a real court... :yes:


This is a game and it is much easier then real life.. If you want to balance the game for fun ? Balance the power baseliners, because they get everything.
0 topsin and all they do is hit rockets, superlow and superfast without hitting the net once.. 0 smash and they can still smash... 0 dropshot and they can still dropshot.. 0 net and they can still come to the net and finish that point... Why ? Because they get 30 points extra from the server settings.. powerbaseliners are OVERPOWERED! (and then they have a pretty mouth thinking they are very skillfull..).

0 means nothing right ? The difference between 0 and 1 = Infinite
So 0 SHOULD BE 0.

Sry about my rage Manuto, but everytime I play against those big mouth baseliners I am cheated..
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby n 201 » 07 Dec 2013, 13:34

yasinozkan wrote:
This is a game and it is much easier then real life.. If you want to balance the game for fun ? Balance the power baseliners, because they get everything.
0 topsin and all they do is hit rockets, superlow and superfast without hitting the net once.. 0 smash and they can still smash... 0 dropshot and they can still dropshot.. 0 net and they can still come to the net and finish that point... Why ? Because they get 30 points extra from the server settings.. powerbaseliners are OVERPOWERED! (and then they have a pretty mouth thinking they are very skillfull..).

0 means nothing right ? The difference between 0 and 1 = Infinite
So 0 SHOULD BE 0.

Sry about my rage Manuto, but everytime I play against those big mouth baseliners I am cheated..

yasinoz, I think the percentages in character sheet are about playing acceleration shots. While playing b1 or b2 normally people won't do many errors.Manutoo mentioned safe 1st serve for b1 and 2nd serve for b2 buttons. As i see i think those two buttons are assigned for safe and slice(more safer) in rallies. So don't expect people doing errors if they play safe shots. i think u play with ur opponents in fair mode, then 0 stat doesn't exist. Even if they keep all 0's in character sheet, if u play someone in fair mode, all the stats get 20% for forehand and service, 15% for backhand and 25% for other skills. So as i see u were talking about baseliners. These players normally have 100 fh and bh in char.sheet but when they play fair mode, fh is 70 and bh is 65. And u said they have 0 smash,0 net, 0 dropshot but in fair mode it will turn into 25% as they are mapped as other skills in the game. So u can expect a 25 power-smash with 25 net positioning, 25 volley percent with 25 dropshot percent. So in fair mode, the points are gained when u set something extremely low and this is neutralised with points which might be lost when u keep some skills at very high value (like 100 becomes 70 for forehand). So then u cannot expect ur opponent to do error right-away when he is playing at net even if he is at net. But u have to know that he will most probably do 3 errors in every 4 acceleration shots at net. So try to retrieve as many shots as possible and remember he may not do many errors with safe shot like using b1 button or slice b2 button,so his only chance to survive at the net is to try slow volleys than acceleration volleys although u can expect one acceleration volley out of 4 going in. Also it is also most probable that these baseliners can do errors after every 3/(10+3) times in rallies if they hit acceleration shots all the time from forehand--->70%==>30% errors on acceleration=3/10,also +3 indicates power baseliners extra acceleration advantage given in game as it was there in documentation.

And yeah what u said about game giving too much power on low shots, i think its quite true because i think the volleys on safe shots are little fast and low as i see its because of 0% topspin....Very difficult to catch them if u stop moving XD There are few unreal things in the game but what makes it special is its closeness to reality. I think this game will become more real in next updates. It actually improved a lot since it started. I appreciate Manu's work. Hope Manutoo looks at it and what u told about ball moving fast on low even when there are net is really really true.

P.S. I really think having topspin should not be effecting certain strokes,like 100% topspin(bouncy stuff) on volleys or slices which are very slow is unreal; Also not having topspin(0%) should not effect those strokes...because they keep very very low and go really fast lol. In my opinion all real life tennis players play at different spins at net and not their rally topspin :fear: ':D
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby manutoo » 08 Dec 2013, 05:24

n 201,
all strikes at net (except for the lobs) have 0 topspin, whatever is the player's topspin skill.
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Re: auto-pos & realism

Postby Yasin Ozkan » 08 Dec 2013, 12:07

I know that about the percentage system. The problem is, not only their points gets devided, but also my points gets devided too. So it basically it comes to the same conclusion.

I think Manuto could create another mode next to "fair" and "realistic", which is a mode like "free mode", but with 780 points without a percentage system (with maybe only service max power 90, but those remaining points should NOT be devided). That way those 100% baseliners will be forced to devide their points, but if they insist playing with 0 net and 0 smash then you actually can attack their weak spot, just like in real tennis.
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